My ketone diet
#1
raypeatclips Wrote:Im struggling to find any posts of yours about diet. Would you be able to give me your brief theories on diet?

Thanks!
I use a diet that is based on the energy source of nutritional ketones. I get them mostly from MCT, but also from coconut oil. 

I find that the medium chain triglycerides are better digested when emulsified. I blend raw egg yolk with the triglycerides to get a good emulsification. You can see it's emulsified because it will then mix with liquid and not separate out after standing. 

It's a handy diet because ketones in the blood can be estimated from ketones in the urine with urine test strips. 

Once I have emulsified oil, I mix it with whatever else I'm eating. Mostly kefir, but also ice cream, cheese cake, cocoa or coffee, and even fruit juice. 

I find it's important not to have too much of the oil at once, or it will lead to cramping and watery stool. 

Ketones are the best way to generate lots of CO2, even better than sugar! The liver, kidneys, heart and brain all use ketones preferentially, if ketones are available. 

Generating CO2 is half the battle. Still, I need to retain it. That's another post we've talked about.
My avatar: William Blake, Vision of Strength
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7sD2Hod.jpg[/img]
#2
What do you think about Roddy's videos on ketosis?
#3
(12-05-2016, 09:32 AM)Arborescence Wrote: What do you think about Roddy's videos on ketosis?

Well, ketosis involves the body making its own ketones during a kind of starvation. I don't do that. I eat a lot of ketones in MCT or coconut oil. Because I eat ketones, my body would never need to enter ketosis to make ketones.

But I also think it's very well established that we can make our own glucose as needed when we have ketones for fuel. We really don't need much sugar in the diet, and perhaps not any, as long as we have plenty of ketones in the diet.

But still, even though sugar is not really necessary when eating a lot of ketones, I like to eat sugar from fruit anyway, just because I feel happy when I do. And why not?
My avatar: William Blake, Vision of Strength
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7sD2Hod.jpg[/img]
#4
After reading through a second time, your diet does not seem that outlandish. Sounds like a fairly normal Peat diet that places emphasis on fats and a little less sugar. How much coconut oil / MCT do you consume per day?
#5
What about the Randle cycle when you eat both fat and sugar? I think that Peat is more advocating a low(er) fat consumption in the diet. You're right, ketosis was not the good term, Roddy was talking about ketogenic diet I guess,

Peat also doesn't seem to really be fond of ketogenic diets. Fat also seems to increase endotoxin absorption in the gut?
#6
(12-05-2016, 01:00 PM)Arborescence Wrote: What about the Randle cycle when you eat both fat and sugar? I think that Peat is more advocating a low(er) fat consumption in the diet. You're right, ketosis was not the good term, Roddy was talking about ketogenic diet I guess,

Peat also doesn't seem to really be fond of ketogenic diets. Fat also seems to increase endotoxin absorption in the gut?

Why do you say fat increases endotoxin? Peat recommends it alongside starch to reduce endotoxin symptoms, people report lower endotoxin symptoms when increasing fat.

There is a study that shows endotoxin increases with "cream" which a few people like posting around. If you look into the study further, and look at what the "cream" actually is, you will see it contains carageenan.
#7
(12-05-2016, 11:17 AM)raypeatclips Wrote: After reading through a second time, your diet does not seem that outlandish. Sounds like a fairly normal Peat diet that places emphasis on fats and a little less sugar. How much coconut oil / MCT do you consume per day?

I experiment with the amount to see how much is needed to keep the ketones present in the urine test. I feel that the experimenting and discovery helps me to escape from the helplessness imposed by the corrupt culture. 

I might guess that somewhere in the range of 80 to 150 grams a day keeps ketones in the urine. But it really is an experiment, because it depends on how much fuel I am using. When my heart is pumping extra hard from hiking or biking, or sometimes even a high energy creative pursuit, I find I need extra ketones.

I have corresponded a bit with Ray about my diet. He has not answered when I've asked him what he thought about it, although he has typically answered my emails. I take that to mean this may not be a "Ray Peat" approved diet. It may be, or it may not. 

I think on the other forum I would be burned without pity for attempting to construe a personal view of their god Peat which conflicts with that forum's dogma. After Pope Charlie Mathers conducted his own secret inquisition.

But again, I feel good about that, because it helps me to feel I am experimenting and discovering. I am still experimenting all the time. Recently, I've started adding coconut milk powder at Jennifer's suggestion. 

Really, Jennifer has led me to much of what I've discovered about myself. Gratitude. If there was a jenniferforum.com, I would join.
My avatar: William Blake, Vision of Strength
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7sD2Hod.jpg[/img]
#8
(12-05-2016, 01:00 PM)Arborescence Wrote: What about the Randle cycle when you eat both fat and sugar? I think that Peat is more advocating a low(er) fat consumption in the diet. You're right, ketosis was not the good term, Roddy was talking about ketogenic diet I guess,

Peat also doesn't seem to really be fond of ketogenic diets. Fat also seems to increase endotoxin absorption in the gut?

The Randle cycle is improved by eating ketones, and quelched almost immediately. The Randle cycle never even starts up when there are ketones available.

Peat himself has at least a third of his calories from fat, and says whenever asked that there is not enough research to known what the best proportions are. 

Yes, I think you're right about Ray's views on a ketogenic diet (which is not my diet). When I've asked Ray about the state of ketosis, or ketogenesis (which is not the same as my nutritional ketone diet), Ray said this: 
Quote:I think Veech’s arguments for the use of ketones nutritionally are good, but the net pathways he (Casazza, et al., 1984) discussed suggest reasons for not wanting to synthesize them yourself; the then as yet unknown process involved in the 1,2-propanediol pathway (which might be from bacteria in the rats) can involve methylglyoxal as well as lactate, and the other pathway more directly involves methylglyoxal. Methylglyoxal and D-lactate have a variety of harmful effects.

If insulin decreases during ketogenesis, amino acid mobilization will be increased, contributing to glucose formation at the expense of tissue protein. Amino acids are known to be the main source of glucose during starvation. Food ketoacids help to spare protein, but ketogenesis consumes protein quickly, and causes glycation of tissue proteins. 
[Emphasis added.]

When fat absorbs endotoxin (and also starch particles) in the gut that is a very good thing. That's how these damaging things can be removed safely. 

It's like taking out the garbage.
My avatar: William Blake, Vision of Strength
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7sD2Hod.jpg[/img]
#9
(12-05-2016, 03:27 PM)raypeatclips Wrote:
(12-05-2016, 01:00 PM)Arborescence Wrote: What about the Randle cycle when you eat both fat and sugar? I think that Peat is more advocating a low(er) fat consumption in the diet. You're right, ketosis was not the good term, Roddy was talking about ketogenic diet I guess,

Peat also doesn't seem to really be fond of ketogenic diets. Fat also seems to increase endotoxin absorption in the gut?

Why do you say fat increases endotoxin? Peat recommends it alongside starch to reduce endotoxin symptoms, people report lower endotoxin symptoms when increasing fat.

There is a study that shows endotoxin increases with "cream" which a few people like posting around. If you look into the study further, and look at what the "cream" actually is, you will see it contains carageenan.

Endotoxins in the blood may appear to increase because they are really being carried by chylomicrons on the way to being safely removed by the liver. 
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article...0-0404.pdf
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article...8-0296.pdf
My avatar: William Blake, Vision of Strength
[img]http://i.imgur.com/7sD2Hod.jpg[/img]
#10
So @vos what are the benefits for your woe? I see increasing co2 but anything else you ar getting for this?
  


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