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Any opinions on this? Given how much people want to mute other people they dont like or dont agree with we're getting close.
Plenty of working class resentment+media monopolies+enormous military expenditure worldwide. The conditions seem pretty good for fascism.


Mass unemployment could be the final straw. That always seem to precede large scale warfare and authoritarianism.
WTF? Where are you getting fascism from?? We're a socialist society getting closer to Marxism..
Where's the evidence of that?


Socialism for the rich maybe.
(09-12-2018, 01:40 PM)Hando-jin Wrote: [ -> ]Where's the evidence of that?


Socialism for the rich maybe.

Fascism and communism are two sides of the same coin, im ok with both descriptions. Hando-jin, i agree with you, i think an economic event is upcominf before a new series of wars. I think the econony may get better fkr awhile and then plunge into a facism. The whole communist bs fascist thing is one of the mechanisms destroying society right now, unfortunately.
Fascism is a left wing, not right wing philosophy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6bSsaVL6gA
Dinesh D'souza is a professional liar/culture warrior who is as useless as balls on a dildo when it comes to a serious discussion of history.

Liquidating leftists is not leftist philosophy. It's the philosophy of leftist's opponents. Hitler's sentiments about unions and organized labour are typical of any modern conservative political party or business council.

Quote:The minority anti-capitalist strand of Nazism (Strasserism) on which van Onselen fastens was eliminated well before 1934, when Gregor Strasser and the Storm Trooper (SA) leader Ernst Roehm were murdered with over eighty others in the "Night of the Long Knives." In fact, Strasserism had already been defeated at the Bamberg Conference of 1926 when the Nazis were polling under 3% of the vote. Here, Hitler brought the dissidents back into line, denouncing them as "communists" and ruling out land expropriations and grassroots decision-making. He heightened the party's alliance with businesses small and large, and insisted on the absolute centralisation of decision-making - the "Fuehrer (leader) Principle."

When the already isolated Strasser brothers tried to reinvigorate their project one last time in 1930, Hitler and Goebbels banded together to force Otto Strasser to leave the party and Gregor Strasser to publicly recant. When the first electoral breakthrough to a popular vote of 18% came in 1930, the Nazi party's anti-capitalist minority were well and truly defeated. The "Night of the Long Knives" purged the old SA, not because they were a hidden vestige of socialism, but because Roehm's army of street thugs were a potential threat to Hitler's personal consolidation of power. A struggle over socialism in the Nazi party played absolutely no role in the purge of 1934.

For their part, businesses welcomed the Nazis' promises to suppress the left. On 20 February 1933, Hitler and Goering met with a large group of industrialists when Hitler declared that democracy and business were incompatible and that the workers needed to be dragged away from socialism. He promised bold action to protect their businesses and property from communism. The industrialists - including leading figures from I.G. Farben, Hoesch, Krupp, Siemens, Allianz and other senior mining and manufacturing groups - then contributed more than two million Reichsmarks to the Nazi election fund, with Goering tellingly suggesting that this would probably be the last election for a hundred years. Business leadership happily jettisoned democracy to rid Germany of socialism and to smash organised labour.

After fighting four elections between 1930 and 1933 on an anti-left and anti-Jewish platform that pledged to slay the mythical beast of "Judeo-Bolshevism," Hitler became Chancellor in 1933 and made good on his promises to business and his voters to destroy socialism in Germany. Most of 1933 was spent persecuting socialists and communists, liquidating their parties, incarcerating and in numerous cases killing their leadership and rank-and-file members.
Trade unions had been in Hitler's sights since a general strike paralysed a right-wing-coup (Kapp Putsch) in 1920. He had witnessed the striking workers and vowed that never again would organised labour prevent the right coming to power. It was the left (trade unions and Jews), after all, that he and others on the right thought had "stabbed" the nation in the back on the home-front to cause the loss of the First World War. By early May 1933, the trade unions had been destroyed. German socialism was in tatters. Not for nothing did Nazis say that the "ideas of 1933" (their national-racial "revolution") had vanquished those of "1789" - namely, the French Revolution and its ideals of equality, fraternity and liberty that have animated the left ever since.

For all the Nazi talk of "four-year plans" and the "guidance of the state," the sanctity of private property and freedom of contract was always preserved under the Nazis, even during the war years. Socialism - in particular, Bolshevism - on the other hand, were pernicious, "Jewish" imports that threatened the vitality of the German Volk.

https://www.abc.net.au/religion/nazism-s...y/10214302
Collectivism is always left wing. Denial of such is lunacy.

Fascism typically also exhibited nationalism, but that doesn't mean the Soviets, who exhibited extreme nationalism, were fascists.

Similarly, fascism containing a religious aspect and allowing some private property doesn't make it right wing.

Today, the right is for small government and the individual. The left is for big government and the group as a whole, which is collectivism. This is simple, and it is common knowledge.

Fascism being labeled as right wing is a huge lie created by the left because of the appalling reputation fascism exhibited by fascism, despite socialism and communism being responsible for far more deaths than any fascist regime. Had the media focused on the vast destruction and mass murder exhibited by communism, they would have said communism was right wing.

Fascism and National Socialism are essentially interchangeable. Communism, Socialism, and Fascism are all quite similar. They are anti-capitalism, anti-indiviualism, and control production and key industries, either through ownership or extreme regulation. The differences between the 3 are minor in comparison to the similarities.

Just because two groups are enemies doesn't mean they are on opposite sides of the political spectrum. That is a red herring.

Christianity isn't evidence of right wing ideology. That's like saying a black American is automatically a criminal. It's a red herring.

Racism doesn't make someone right wing. Another red herring.

The mental gymnastics people go through to try to cover up the undeniable truth is amazing.

Fascism is big government. Fact.
Fascism is anti-capitalism. Fact.
Fascism is anti-individualism. Fact.

These are the opposite of right wing.
Nationalism is collectivist in nature and is part of capitalism. Same goes with religion.

The rest of what you say are political slogans. US right wing presidents have only ever grown state power, for example. If you look you'll notice military spending goes up drastically under conservative governments and the most draconian anti-terrorism laws have been bought in under the right wing in recent decades.

I really do not understand how you can take such a black and white view. The right is not 'for the individual' in any sense of the term's meaning. Corporations are given total supremacy over the worker, abortion has been fought by conservatives at every turn as was gay marriage, drug use is criminalised, prayer in schools. How are these not personal choices being infringed upon by an all powerful state?

Quote:Fascism is anti-capitalism. Fact.

Here's the actual history again:

Quote:Under Hitler, the party looked squarely to the middle classes and farmers rather than the working class for a political base. Hitler realigned it to ensure that it was an anti-socialist, anti-liberal, authoritarian, pro-business party - particularly after the failed Beerhall Putsch of 1923. The "socialism" in the name National Socialism was a strategically chosen misnomer designed to attract working class votes where possible, but they refused to take the bait. The vast majority voted for the Communist or Social Democratic parties.

The minority anti-capitalist strand of Nazism (Strasserism) on which van Onselen fastens was eliminated well before 1934, when Gregor Strasser and the Storm Trooper (SA) leader Ernst Roehm were murdered with over eighty others in the "Night of the Long Knives." In fact, Strasserism had already been defeated at the Bamberg Conference of 1926 when the Nazis were polling under 3% of the vote. Here, Hitler brought the dissidents back into line, denouncing them as "communists" and ruling out land expropriations and grassroots decision-making. He heightened the party's alliance with businesses small and large, and insisted on the absolute centralisation of decision-making - the "Fuehrer (leader) Principle."

When the already isolated Strasser brothers tried to reinvigorate their project one last time in 1930, Hitler and Goebbels banded together to force Otto Strasser to leave the party and Gregor Strasser to publicly recant. When the first electoral breakthrough to a popular vote of 18% came in 1930, the Nazi party's anti-capitalist minority were well and truly defeated.

On 20 February 1933, Hitler and Goering met with a large group of industrialists when Hitler declared that democracy and business were incompatible and that the workers needed to be dragged away from socialism. He promised bold action to protect their businesses and property from communism. The industrialists - including leading figures from I.G. Farben, Hoesch, Krupp, Siemens, Allianz and other senior mining and manufacturing groups - then contributed more than two million Reichsmarks to the Nazi election fund, with Goering tellingly suggesting that this would probably be the last election for a hundred years. Business leadership happily jettisoned democracy to rid Germany of socialism and to smash organised labour.

Massively powerful private companies have no place in anti-capitalist thought, if you care about the meanings of words.

You're under a spell courtesy of serial liars who's only interest is to smite their political enemies. If you can honestly convince yourself that people who publicly denounced leftists and socialists, rounded them up and imprisoned and killed them, then persued the very economic and political objectives that socialists railed against, then you can probably convince yourself of anything.

Tirades against trade unions and organized labour, dog-whistles about immigrants and 'outsiders' and corporate power were the bread and butter of the Nazi party. They are also still the main tactics of right wing politicians today.
Hando, can you give your general views on the following:

The Israel-Palestine conflict.

"Hate" speech.
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